Comment on LiveOverflow - php situation 24h later (YouTube)

• Thaurin@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

  Don’t people use unattended upgrades? Crowdsec’s WAF Appsec or Cloudfare’s WAF also put up patches that would’ve caught these vulnerabilities before the official PHP patches were released.

  Of course, those normally run once per 24 hours, which is a little late…

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  • Luckyfriend222@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    No. Unattended upgrades are a nightmare in production. If you patch stuff manually or even with ansible, you can see what the hell broke during the upgrade. Whereas with unattended access you walk in Monday morning with half your systems down and no idea which update broke it.

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    • needanke@feddit.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      For professionals, buisnesses sure. But for selfhosting? If I wake up one morning and my stuff is not working anymore, I can just roll back to the last good backup and then apply patches manually to see where it goes wrong. Way better to have some downtime when I don’t notice (i.e. don’t need the service) than having open vulnerabilities.

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    • Thaurin@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      Yeah, for businesses I can see that, but selfhosting, meh. I have just one personal server firewalled and Wireguarded, so the PHP vulnerability wasn’t even publicly exposed. Even so, I have never had any issues with Debian’s unattended security upgrades in the last 5 years.

      In enterprise environments with a hundred servers, though, you will want to do something else than I do. :)

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    • frongt@lemmy.zip ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      Unattended application to test. If it passes testing, unattended application to prod.

      I still wouldn’t do this for any critical service, but for a “move fast and break things” system like Facebook where it goes down and nothing bad happens, sure.

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  • stuner@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    It would be interesting to know what share of servers have that enabled.

    I have it enabled on Debian and Ubuntu and I’m quite happy with it. But I had pretty bad experiences with reboot-less updates on other (desktop) distros.

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    • Thaurin@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      I think Debian is probably pretty conservative in their updates. I also recommend checking out the needrestart package. It will tell you when a reboot is needed because of a newer kernel that was installed, or when a systemd service needs a restart.

      But as another commenter noted, outside of self hosting, in enterprise businesses environments where you manage an army of servers, things look different. But then, these guys are paid to be on-call in the weekend for events like these. :)

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  • non_burglar@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    The path to uptime is paved with understanding what broke and when.

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  • Zwuzelmaus@feddit.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    Don’t people use unattended upgrades?

    php can be a real nightmare even with it’s well-attended upgrades :)

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    • Thaurin@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      Well, we’re talking (Debian’s) security updates only here, not major PHP version jumps. :)

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