Lemmchen@feddit.org 2 days ago
TL;DW?
It’s only 2 minutes video, so I recommend to watch to listen to the source yourself.
The interviewer asks about Anticheat situation and Valve employee responds they are working to make it as easy as possible for developers to support Anticheat and build. Hardware modules are in place and whenever help needed, Valve tries to help the developers. But ultimately it is up to the developers to support.
My bad. I’ve clicked the YouTube link and seen that it was two hours long, but didn’t see the clip you actually posted.
There’s no reason your games anticheat shouldn’t be working under Linux.
No reason is not entirely correct. If the Anticheat system only works at Kernel level, then it would not work on Linux. But they can opt in into a Linux version of the Anticheat system, that does not require Kernel level access. But that comes at a risk, because this is easier to work around as a cheater. Also do some Anticheat systems not require the hardware TPM module?
Plus if they don’t know much about Linux, its harder to support that platform as well. Because its not just about the Anticheat, but if the game runs on Linux, they have to make sure every component runs well too. Which they do often, but if any problem arises, they could get bombarded with Linux issues they do not entirely understand.
While in most cases the Linux support could be “easily” possible, as some games show it. One cannot just argue that there would be “no reason” why the Anticheat doesn’t work on Linux. There are technical reasons.
And when Windows removes the ability to use kernel level anticheating?
It’s nothing but a crutch for developers to detect cheaters. Look at Arc Raiders for example.
Fundamentally the reason they want to use kernel modules is to observe the system for other executables interfering with the game. This is a hacky solution at best
The TPM hardware can support attested boot so you can verify with the hardware nothing but the verified kernel and userspace is running. That gives you the same guarantees but without letting third parties mess with your kernel.
There was a thread here the other day talking about this specific kernel level being “needed” essentially it doesn’t need kernel level because cheaters hack tools also go down to kernel level and if you wanted to cheat these kernel level anti cheats aren’t doing anything to prevent that.
That’s not true. It DOES help to have kernel level access for the Anticheat. Just because there are systems that can workaround this protection does not mean every cheat is able to break that.
Every current, major, third party AntiCheat system has supported Linux since 2022.
You are correct that they figure out a way to do it without kernel access when on Linux, and when the game devs take advantage of the support that they are already paying for, to help them customize/tweak the AC and the game to work together.
This is a fine solution, because 99.9% of cheats you can easily buy for money via a 60 second websearch only work on Windows, and there are many, effective ways to do AC that do not require Kernel Access.
Many AC systems do not need a TPM2 to work.
There were tons of AC systems that did their jobs before Microsoft pushed everyone to adopt TPM2.
As for as games running on Linux: Basically everything that is not using some cutting edge driver/feature from Nvidia works on Linux via Proton.
Thats the scenario that the major thirdparty ACs who have supported Linux since 2022 primarily target.
If a game or proprietary AC does not support Linux, that is either a deliberate business decision, or down to incompetence from the devs cough Facepunch cough.
If the Anticheat system only works at Kernel level, then it would not work on Linux.
The same kernel level anticheats used in Helldivers 2 don’t work for other games simply because the developer of those games doesn’t spend the 15 minutes it would take to compile the Linux version of the anticheat.
No? Helldivers 2 Anticheat system on Linux does not use Kernel level system. It runs at user level, and that’s the point. Nobody said it won’t work on Linux, the problem is that at user level, the Anticheat can easily be circumvented. At least at Kernel level this is massive harder to do and more complicated. I play myself Marvel Rivals and it has Anticheat on Linux too. Valve has a system too for their games such as Counter Strike. But these will never be as effective as one with Kernel level access.
And as explained before, its not just about the Anticheat working on Linux, the game itself needs to work (well) too. You guys need to understand its not just a switch to flip or a command to build a Linux version. That’s not how game development is all about. There is more behind all of this.
tiramichu@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Valve are working on what they can from the OS side, but fundamentally there’s no silver bullet and it’s up to game devs to implement anti-cheat in a way that works for SteamOS if they want games that require anti cheat to work.
My personal interpretation is that we remain in the same situation as ever, and games which have invasive anticheat will continue to not work on Linux unless the game developers make them work - and publishers won’t do that until Linux as a gaming platform has sufficient market share that they would lose a large chunk of money by not supporting it.
Tanoh@lemmy.world 2 days ago
It is also possible that microsoft will disallow it in the future. Even they realise what a huge attack vector it is.
donio@lemmy.world 1 day ago
I thought that they would come to their senses after the CrowdStrike fiasco.
Tattorack@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Valve has a lot of work cut out for them. Not on the development side as much as on the general adoption side.